Show me yours I'll show you mine.

azaghal · 2013-08-01 19:51:05

Ludicrosity wrote:

I remember a while back when you were first building it, you had your vault next to the entrance, behind a closed door. I got so used to running in there to grab a few hundred dollars for free that I ended up losing my own house when one day I barged through the door without looking around and instead found no vault but trap doors and a power door that closed behind me. Whoops!

Surprise! I think doors are a fun element for that reason (not that it was fun for you at the time...). I didn't even plan such a bait-and-switch, but the ability to even superficially hide information like that just adds another level to a house's atmosphere.

bey bey wrote:

It's an odd strategy that has evolved as of now. I assume it's an attempt to make it to a safe house with a family alive, which usually fails during mid-game when the wife gets killed because she's less well protected than the safe. Focusing on the other element (i.e. the wife) is an interesting way to get around this problem.

That's the way I've always used houses like that, as a temporary stop gap until I can adequately defend both my wife AND safe from the $2000 start-up crew. Leaving a house like that is for sure boring, but I think it's a reasonable starting strategy seeing as your money is replaceable while your wife is not (and you must decide on one or the other at the beginning or risk ruination...).

pottage · 2013-08-02 03:56:05

azaghal wrote:

bey bey wrote:
It's an odd strategy that has evolved as of now. I assume it's an attempt to make it to a safe house with a family alive, which usually fails during mid-game when the wife gets killed because she's less well protected than the safe. Focusing on the other element (i.e. the wife) is an interesting way to get around this problem.
That's the way I've always used houses like that, as a temporary stop gap until I can adequately defend both my wife AND safe from the $2000 start-up crew. Leaving a house like that is for sure boring, but I think it's a reasonable starting strategy seeing as your money is replaceable while your wife is not (and you must decide on one or the other at the beginning or risk ruination...).

I'm not sure about that, my last few houses since the new animal movement rules, I've found that the starting $2000 has been enough to build a rudimentary trap system and place a strategic dog or two - which require $1000 each to get past - to protect the family, and have been able to keep them and my vault safe (Until I walk on a pitbull that is). Plus, as you say, it's more fun. Then I usually use my first few hundred $'s wages to reinforce my family to make them survive their first night while I'm in bed.

Cent · 2013-08-02 05:09:48

Even if you have a good dog or two, on the initial 2000, you'll have paper thin walls somewhere. A simple saw will get you through and allow u to lead the dogs elsewhere to be drugged.

I find keeping the family alive basically entails that you thicken the walls quickly and hope for a bit of luck. That or succeed in robbing another house within the first 10 minutes of starting yours so you can lay down some concrete.

LOL. Someone just busted me with 58 Ladders. GG He stole at most half of that value (incl paintings, etc)

Last edited by Cent (2013-08-02 15:29:06)

joshwithguitar · 2013-08-03 12:47:20

Colorfusion, the house you died in as Mr Smith looks an awful lot like one of mine around that time, maybe I was Mr Nash? I wasn't checking names at the time. Did it start with a fairly rudimentary running cat triggering a trapdoor as you pass it?
If so Mr Nash died fairly soon after that walking on a sleeping dog .

colorfusion · 2013-08-03 13:55:13

joshwithguitar wrote:

Colorfusion, the house you died in as Mr Smith looks an awful lot like one of mine around that time, maybe I was Mr Nash? I wasn't checking names at the time. Did it start with a fairly rudimentary running cat triggering a trapdoor as you pass it?
If so Mr Nash died fairly soon after that walking on a sleeping dog .

I think so.

The part I died in I could have easily been more careful and worked out, I just didn't bother checking the tile that the switch was on.

azaghal · 2013-08-03 18:17:41

Cent wrote:

Even if you have a good dog or two, on the initial 2000, you'll have paper thin walls somewhere. A simple saw will get you through and allow u to lead the dogs elsewhere to be drugged.

Exactly. You need at least 4 concrete between the robber and the rest of the empty house or else they just bust out and lead your dogs out into the open to get drugged. Just lost my wife again to that since I let too much money get built up.

I do find it very frustrating how hard it is to keep my family alive. I feel it's important if I ever want to rebuild after a robbery, but it's just infeasible unless you religiously log in every hour or so to spend your money and make sure no one feels like spending the money to take them out. Maybe I'm just bad at this part of the game, though.

bey bey · 2013-08-04 07:19:16

Well, I'd say less is enough. The robber only has to ASSUME there are lots of concrete walls. Sometimes, one can fool people into attacking in the wrong places. Or better still - to just leave. Nothing is safe forever, but it can work. I once did an experiment between houses only placing traps without electricity or anything, bought a few 1$ paintings etc. and it took a solid few robberies until somebody smelt the bacon.

azaghal · 2013-08-04 11:09:21

bey bey wrote:

Well, I'd say less is enough. The robber only has to ASSUME there are lots of concrete walls. Sometimes, one can fool people into attacking in the wrong places. Or better still - to just leave. Nothing is safe forever, but it can work. I once did an experiment between houses only placing traps without electricity or anything, bought a few 1$ paintings etc. and it took a solid few robberies until somebody smelt the bacon.

That's true to a certain extent, but some players simply will keep burning $2000 worth of tools and killing themselves elsewhere to find a weak spot. Plus, I think you can see through the walls well enough to distinguish between thicknesses of 3 and 4.

bey bey · 2013-08-04 11:22:04

I think that a two-concrete-thick wall can be seen whereas with 3 you can't guess how much more is there. Still, after one or two nukes at least you'll know how much more wall is to come. My suggestion for dealing with 2k players is to try and get a killing trap going quickly. Something they can try out and fall into/be fried on. Most people won't bring 4 dynamite instantly and if they die trying out your trap, they'll be barred by chills for a while and probably forget to bring 4 boom-booms the next time they visit. Psychology. Of course, 2k-proof walls are one of the first things that will have to be done as soon as the cash is there. For family protection that means 2 pitbulls. The best option is to space them according to field of view. All other ways of doing it are prone to 2k attacks (drug the first one, make the others pile up, shoot the first one and club the others - takes out up to 10 pitbulls with starting cash).

Still, I also think that it's a.) impossible to create something with 2k that an experienced player with 2k won't be able to crack AND b.) that usually a family won't survive either the first night or the later assaults that come once you have about 20k in the house. That's why I decided not to try and start over and protect my new family but to re-fortify my solitary house. A dead wife is always slightly frustrating.

colorfusion · 2013-08-04 11:32:32

I think seeing how many walls depends on the angle you're at. Sideways it seems you can't even see the difference between 2 and above.

jere · 2013-08-18 05:11:04

I think I've died stepping on drugged pitbulls like 50 times.

Anyway, I am kind of proud of this house. I was using the hide-yo-wife strategy, so I kept trying risky things with the safe. The result was a safe that is pretty easy to get to, but tries to divert your attention away from that location. I wanted something that shouted "oh it's definitely not there." A pitbull behind a door is usually an indicator of a completely unsafe dead end.
http://castledraft.com/editor/X2QNaH

Last edited by jere (2013-08-18 05:19:49)

nathan · 2013-08-18 06:53:49

jere wrote:

I was using the hide-yo-wife strategy

Plagiarism!

Last edited by nathan (2013-08-18 14:05:22)

bey bey · 2013-08-18 08:57:23

jere wrote:

I think I've died stepping on drugged pitbulls like 50 times.
Anyway, I am kind of proud of this house. I was using the hide-yo-wife strategy, so I kept trying risky things with the safe. The result was a safe that is pretty easy to get to, but tries to divert your attention away from that location. I wanted something that shouted "oh it's definitely not there." A pitbull behind a door is usually an indicator of a completely unsafe dead end.
http://castledraft.com/editor/X2QNaH

Haha, sweet!!! One might try and do the same with the wife&kids: Have an "obvious" wife and kids corridor go upwards all the way with lots of dogs and really hide them somewhere in a corridor that looks like it has another purpose.

largestherb · 2013-08-18 14:25:21

mmmm dead children http://castledraft.com/editor/cd2OyI

bey bey · 2013-08-21 10:55:40

Last few hours before the reset and I'm off to a BBQ so the spoils are up for grabs: go get them: http://castledraft.com/editor/82K4t9

Blip · 2013-08-21 11:38:30

Well, I would take all your sweet money...
but the server's already rejecting my v15 client.

gumshoe · 2013-08-21 11:40:41

bey bey wrote:

Last few hours before the reset and I'm off to a BBQ so the spoils are up for grabs: go get them: http://castledraft.com/editor/82K4t9

In the third section (the second one with the cat) how do you get the chewy to see you? Can it see you through that window even when you cant see it yourself? 0_0. That was the bit that was bugging me.

bey bey · 2013-08-21 17:53:14

That's what the additional trapdoor below is for: If you take that extra step to the left, you get a different field of view, so you can walk across the pattern. Then you have to go back down right and send the kittie to activate the upper trapdoors I think. Interestingly, nobody got this despite the window being visible.

And you needed to take along the first chihuahua to walk past the dogs behind doors so that they chased you for the switch thingee but that's obvious I guess.

This was probably the house I was fondest of so far since it was all about lots of small, intermixed bits instead of one massive security system, and I could move the safe around quite a bit in reaction to how close people got to it (AND it kept my family safe by distracting people!!!!!!!!!!!!). I hoped to refine this so there were actually many paths to different safe locations, possibly combined with minuscule changes that made certain things work in different ways depending on what I wanted while looking the same. Quite sad that this complex kind of thing is impossible with v16.

gumshoe · 2013-08-21 17:55:35

bey bey wrote:

That's what the additional trapdoor below is for: If you take that extra step to the left, you get a different field of view, so you can walk across the pattern. Then you have to go back down right and send the kittie to activate the upper trapdoors I think. Interestingly, nobody got this despite the window being visible.
And you needed to take along the first chihuahua to walk past the dogs behind doors so that they chased you for the switch thingee but that's obvious I guess.
This was probably the house I was fondest of so far since it was all about lots of small, intermixed bits instead of one massive security system, and I could move the safe around quite a bit in reaction to how close people got to it (AND it kept my family safe by distracting people!!!!!!!!!!!!). I hoped to refine this so there were actually many paths to different safe locations, possibly combined with minuscule changes that made certain things work in different ways depending on what I wanted while looking the same. Quite sad that this complex kind of thing is impossible with v16.

The dog that triggers thats used to traverse the second section, but traps you on the third was brilliant ( : Part of me is gonna miss the magic dance ) :.

bey bey · 2013-08-21 18:12:22

Haha, yeah, I liked those sorts of gimmicks. This kind of "dammit what just happened?!", but not as a complex thing where you walk along a corridor with no chance of survival but rather with this feeling of "Oh if only I had brought two ladders!!". This is what I hoped could be kept alive by severely limiting the range of electronics. Not "real" magic dances with ten steps but something where the one or other hidden switch is possible and you can kick yourself for not guessing where it might strike.

joshwithguitar · 2013-08-21 18:37:41

Bey Bey: I'm glad I decided to tackle your place just before the reset, it was fun .

I started up the application before I realised V16 was out and it cleared my stdout file so I can't post my most old house (Mr Johnson) . I'm also sad I can't see the final attempts at my house before the reset.

bey bey · 2013-08-21 18:42:33

Kudos!! Actually implementing a breaker switch surrounding the entire house was a brilliant thing to do and probably the only reason why I didn't kill your wife despite having enough cash and tools in the vault after you had come for me.

joshwithguitar · 2013-08-21 19:34:48

I would have loved to see you try, through, as she was already dead! Ludicrosity got her and my children on his rampage. Also, how can you be sure you had enough money to even get to her body?

gumshoe · 2013-08-21 19:51:11

joshwithguitar wrote:

I would have loved to see you try, through, as she was already dead! Ludicrosity got her and my children on his rampage. Also, how can you be sure you had enough money to even get to her body?

damm, you were running that house on just a widowed dads salary alone? By the way, what did you think when you saw I'd cracked your dance at 2 am XD. I was so upset that you got up ) : otherwise I'd have had your house for sure : P.

joshwithguitar · 2013-08-22 01:24:32

Your running on the assumption that we live in the same time-zone gumshoe, this is probably not the case .
Also, there were a lot of doors to look behind, there is no guarantee you would have picked the right one in time.

Here is my final house:
(thanks to ukoko for letting me know about recorded games).
http://castledraft.com/editor/XqzjPz

I built this one mostly as a way to mitigate brute forcing by allowing the vault to be in many locations so just "following the trapdoors" wouldn't lead you there. I'm glad I got to implement this before the changes came in, a bit sad that no one gave it a good brute force attempt once it was properly completed.

The Castle Doctrine Forums

#101 2013-08-01 19:51:05

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#102 2013-08-02 03:56:05

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#103 2013-08-02 05:09:48

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#104 2013-08-03 12:47:20

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#105 2013-08-03 13:55:13

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#106 2013-08-03 18:17:41

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#107 2013-08-04 07:19:16

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#108 2013-08-04 11:09:21

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#109 2013-08-04 11:22:04

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#110 2013-08-04 11:32:32

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#111 2013-08-18 05:11:04

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#112 2013-08-18 06:53:49

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#113 2013-08-18 08:57:23

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#114 2013-08-18 14:25:21

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#115 2013-08-21 10:55:40

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#116 2013-08-21 11:38:30

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#117 2013-08-21 11:40:41

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#118 2013-08-21 17:53:14

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#119 2013-08-21 17:55:35

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

#120 2013-08-21 18:12:22

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#121 2013-08-21 18:37:41

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#122 2013-08-21 18:42:33

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#123 2013-08-21 19:34:48

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#124 2013-08-21 19:51:11

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#125 2013-08-22 01:24:32

Re: Show me yours I'll show you mine.

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