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#1 2014-04-13 19:57:45

Welkin
Member
Registered: 2014-02-07
Posts: 21

I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Now it's not a complaint about content. It's not a complaint about design. The complaint may be routed in multiple account abusers, but not that they exist but what someone can do.

Let me tell you about a story of Joseph Gerald Alexander and his nameless posse.

As a top dog house, every once in a while you get someone who will probe you with a reasonable amount of tools, not too much of a commitment but enough to see what goes on past a commit gate or 2. This is in contrast to the 2k divers who plan on suicide and just run straight ahead.

I had someone (Joseph Gerald Alexander) break in with around 4k in tools and check out a bit then leave, I took a look at his house and it was at 4k. Sure, murder she wrote and he died, down to 1k value (cause of living wife). Later the same day he breaks in again with 6k in tools followed immediately after by 12k tools. Strange... probably a multiple account user but I don't mind too much.

Then I had a time where my house was locked out by Alec Sean Farley who in combination with JGA did this strange tag-team lock. During this time every click of 'return to house' that got denied refreshed the list that I had filtered to his account. I watched his money go from 2k, to 12k, to 60k, to 30k (I assume he grabbed items from his stock? Maybe had an account rob him back to take half?) in the span of literally minutes. I could do nothing, luckily this guy was not able to break too much of the surface, but then I realized the scope of the money he could pull in.

He basically was un-killable, only thing I could target was JGA which he had no investment in. He was only a front to attack me and take any heat he could get. ASF and his 30k that wasn't used to attack me dissipated. This annoys me so much, after two days of being stalked by this guy I gave up. It's not like my value was even that high, I was mid on the top 8 list. Not sure what he was doing but I'll be damned if it didn't ruin my fun. Being attacked by people you can defend from and attack back, that would be ok. Being targeted by someone you do not know, who can siphon his resources seemingly at a whim, who sends an alt to lock me out of my house while he sets up another account, that is not ok.

Is this a problem with multiple accounts? Sortof. It's not the multiple accounts, it's the lack of paper trail. I was being attacked by multiple accounts who were sharing money in such a way that I could not trace the money back. If this was a movie I'd be saying 'follow the money'. If I could follow the money and found the source, some Jerk Jerky Jerkington who I could attack and set this attack back I'd be happy. But there is none. Cut off one head and another would emerge.

I hope the owner of JGA comes forward and takes credit for his actions, I really want to know who they are.

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#2 2014-04-13 20:57:42

TheRealCheese
Member
Registered: 2014-01-25
Posts: 349

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

This sounds horrendous sad

Last edited by TheRealCheese (2014-04-13 20:57:54)

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#3 2014-04-13 21:42:51

Lord0fHam
Member
From: California
Registered: 2014-02-11
Posts: 487

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

I am really sorry to hear this and hope you will continue to play. I really enjoy watching you stream your robberies as they are a very good learning experience. I think you are by far the best robber in the game and I know you don't cheat because we can watch the robberies. I really hope you decide to continue playing.


It's a trap!

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#4 2014-04-14 01:50:22

Kimenzar
Member
Registered: 2014-02-04
Posts: 183

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Houseowner should get priority if they come into  their house, so they will be next in the their house.

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#5 2014-04-14 01:57:14

eppfel
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 2014-02-01
Posts: 324
Website

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Hello, there! JGA here.
First, I feel for you, with such an awful situation. I love your videos on twitch and learned a lot, but the story is not quite like you put it down.

Welkin wrote:

It's not like my value was even that high, I was mid on the top 8 list.

I had you on my list , because my main was Earl Michael Case with the $110k and with that amount of money I wanted to collect paintings, starting with the player, who had the most – Seaman. And you were 2nd with $40k at some point.
But actually, I wanted someone to brute-force my house (There was only one failed attempt to that point) and I was looking forward to see your stream of my house going down, or you failing. I refreshed your twitch at least 10 times yesterday, to see, if you're online. But at the same time I wanted to keep my options to get to your house, if I would recover from your attack.

JGA was my robbing alt. It is a setup against 2k suicide robbers, but I invest all the money into scouting people. I would not work around chills, if I die, but I did not. I admit, that one of the money fluctuations was my third account, who was a robbing account as well, but I was tired of his broken house(had been up for a week, letting a few people grab some easy money) and wanted to do some suicide robbing for fun.

But now to the flaws in your story/theory:

All other cash fluctuations of JGA, where successful robberies.

Welkin wrote:

Then I had a time where my house was locked out by Alec Sean Farley who in combination with JGA did this strange tag-team lock.

Mr. Farley is not my account it is Blip's and he robbed my $110k with it: The post of his success
Case robbed by Farley

Welkin wrote:

.., after two days of being stalked by this guy I gave up.

Further I did not rob you and was shocked seeing the tape of you dying to my trapdoor this morning. With just using the ladder, you would have reached the vault. (Let's see, how long the house lasts know :-/)

Welkin wrote:

Sure, murder she wrote and he died, down to 1k value (cause of living wife).

Can you explain what this means? Did you rob me with an alt? I recovered easily with the help of Mr. Connel and Mr. Semple.

I think it was just the cruelty of this game, because Blip was after the paintings as well and we both use dual accounts for funding, although I can not speak for him.
So, I really hope it is not the last time of you around here. I would sacrifice JGA with his nice bounty head, if you needed a starting fund. ;-)

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#6 2014-04-14 01:57:23

MMaster
Member
Registered: 2014-02-12
Posts: 325

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Really sad. I'm sorry to hear that. I also hope that someone steps up and explains how and why he did that.

EDIT: apparently he already did while I was writing.

Last edited by MMaster (2014-04-14 01:58:18)


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#7 2014-04-14 01:58:14

eppfel
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 2014-02-01
Posts: 324
Website

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

MMaster wrote:

Really sad. I'm sorry to hear that. I also hope that someone steps up and explains how and why he did that.

Too slow ;-)

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#8 2014-04-14 02:05:06

MMaster
Member
Registered: 2014-02-12
Posts: 325

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

eppfel wrote:

Hello, there! JGA here.
First, I feel for you, with such an awful situation. I love your videos on twitch and learned a lot, but the story is not quite like you put it down.

Welkin wrote:

It's not like my value was even that high, I was mid on the top 8 list.

I had you on my list , because my main was Earl Michael Case with the $110k and with that amount of money I wanted to collect paintings, starting with the player, who had the most – Seaman. And you were 2nd with $40k at some point.
But actually, I wanted someone to brute-force my house (There was only one failed attempt to that point) and I was looking forward to see your stream of my house going down, or you failing. I refreshed your twitch at least 10 times yesterday, to see, if you're online. But at the same time I wanted to keep my options to get to your house, if I would recover from your attack.

JGA was my robbing alt. It is a setup against 2k suicide robbers, but I invest all the money into scouting people. I would not work around chills, if I die, but I did not. I admit, that one of the money fluctuations was my third account, who was a robbing account as well, but I was tired of his broken house(had been up for a week, letting a few people grab some easy money) and wanted to do some suicide robbing for fun.

But now to the flaws in your story/theory:

All other cash fluctuations of JGA, where successful robberies.

Welkin wrote:

Then I had a time where my house was locked out by Alec Sean Farley who in combination with JGA did this strange tag-team lock.

Mr. Farley is not my account it is Blip's and he robbed my $110k with it: The post of his success
http://i.imgur.com/Od7IGEK.png

Welkin wrote:

.., after two days of being stalked by this guy I gave up.

Further I did not rob you and was shocked seeing the tape of you dying to my trapdoor this morning. With just using the ladder, you would have reached the vault. (Let's see, how long the house lasts know :-/)

Welkin wrote:

Sure, murder she wrote and he died, down to 1k value (cause of living wife).

Can you explain what this means? Did you rob me with an alt? I recovered easily with the help of Mr. Connel and Mr. Semple.

I think it was just the cruelty of this game, because Blip was after the paintings as well and we both use dual accounts for funding, although I can not speak for him.
So, I really hope it is not the last time of you around here. I would sacrifice JGA with his nice bounty head, if you needed a starting fund. ;-)

This game can be really unfair sometimes. I think the multiple account talk makes people even more paranoid. It surely looked like multiple account abuse from Welkin's point of view.


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#9 2014-04-14 02:07:43

eppfel
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 2014-02-01
Posts: 324
Website

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

MMaster wrote:

This game can be really unfair sometimes. I think the multiple account talk makes people even more paranoid. It surely looked like multiple account abuse from Welkin's point of view.

And it was, to some point. It is a cruel story, but unfair? In the end he died to his own mistake..

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#10 2014-04-14 02:09:59

StefanLindskog
Member
From: Oslo, Norway
Registered: 2014-02-22
Posts: 268

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

eppfel wrote:

JGA was my robbing alt.

Grow some balls and go single account. Robbing with your single account, putting everything on line, is robbing like a man.

I have the spirit of a warrior. You have the spirit of a housewife. You lose!


Current life: Unknown

Rotary toggle switches... Sooooo sexy.

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#11 2014-04-14 02:41:32

MMaster
Member
Registered: 2014-02-12
Posts: 325

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

eppfel wrote:
MMaster wrote:

This game can be really unfair sometimes. I think the multiple account talk makes people even more paranoid. It surely looked like multiple account abuse from Welkin's point of view.

And it was, to some point. It is a cruel story, but unfair? In the end he died to his own mistake..

Unfair in a way where 2 people decide to rob your house at the same time it can look like you are being locked out of your house and you are basically powerless. But that part was apparently completely within the game rules as you were 2 different people.
On the other side pumping your account with money from 2 other accounts is unfair to all people that don't have 2/3 accounts. I personally don't care, but there are some people that do care and I understand why.


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#12 2014-04-14 03:12:21

eppfel
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 2014-02-01
Posts: 324
Website

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

StefanLindskog wrote:

Grow some balls and go single account. Robbing with your single account, putting everything on line, is robbing like a man.

I have the spirit of a warrior. You have the spirit of a housewife. You lose!

Hua! shouted the housewife.. I go robbing with all of my accounts. Triple the fun. Mr. Case became King with a few big heists.

MMaster wrote:

Unfair in a way where 2 people decide to rob your house at the same time it can look like you are being locked out of your house and you are basically powerless. But that part was apparently completely within the game rules as you were 2 different people.

Yeah, there was a lot of discussion on 'game rules'. I am still confused, what to think..

MMaster wrote:

On the other side pumping your account with money from 2 other accounts is unfair to all people that don't have 2/3 accounts. I personally don't care, but there are some people that do care and I understand why.

As stated before, I do not work around chills and – besides the startup funding – most of the money comes from successful robberies. Maybe the transferal from my 3rd alt to JGA was giving me to much of an advantage. I'm not sure...
I will go on using multiple accounts, as long as I have time to maintain them.

Last edited by eppfel (2014-04-14 03:13:05)

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#13 2014-04-14 03:44:07

cullman
Member
Registered: 2014-03-21
Posts: 424

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

eppfel wrote:
StefanLindskog wrote:

Grow some balls and go single account. Robbing with your single account, putting everything on line, is robbing like a man.

I have the spirit of a warrior. You have the spirit of a housewife. You lose!

Hua! shouted the housewife.. I go robbing with all of my accounts. Triple the fun. Mr. Case became King with a few big heists.

MMaster wrote:

Unfair in a way where 2 people decide to rob your house at the same time it can look like you are being locked out of your house and you are basically powerless. But that part was apparently completely within the game rules as you were 2 different people.

Yeah, there was a lot of discussion on 'game rules'. I am still confused, what to think..

MMaster wrote:

On the other side pumping your account with money from 2 other accounts is unfair to all people that don't have 2/3 accounts. I personally don't care, but there are some people that do care and I understand why.

As stated before, I do not work around chills and – besides the startup funding – most of the money comes from successful robberies. Maybe the transferal from my 3rd alt to JGA was giving me to much of an advantage. I'm not sure...
I will go on using multiple accounts, as long as I have time to maintain them.

Bottom line alts and people that use them ruin this game.

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#14 2014-04-14 04:25:02

Nakula
Member
Registered: 2014-03-03
Posts: 66

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

the guy got alt abused, and lost his cool. i dont see how theres an excuse for this. "oh it was just my alt, i was just checking your place out!"...and you say it like nothings wrong. this is why the dude is pissed. how does he know what the abusers intentions are? he clearly sees theres some abuse going on, he can only assume the worst. but he didnt just cry about it, he tried to do his homework and figure out where it all led  back to and there ended up being a third account! no big deal! so the dude is panicking that some triple account cheater is about to destroy all his hard work. gotta find them all and take them out faster than he can take out mine. its the only way. he didnt have time to properly map out the houses. you see how this guy works, hes methodical as fuck when he robs. he figures hes about to be cheated so time is at his throat now. he tried to work quickly through your house, and he dies. surprised? u shouldnt be. and ALL that shit coulda been prevented if people just played the game as intended

cullman wrote:

Bottom line alts and people that use them ruin this game.

True words.

Last edited by Nakula (2014-04-14 04:30:41)

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#15 2014-04-14 06:41:28

AMWhy
Member
Registered: 2014-02-04
Posts: 432

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Eppfel was on the list but didn't respond at all.  Most likely trying to lay low after his dodgy dual account usage.

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#16 2014-04-14 07:09:55

StefanLindskog
Member
From: Oslo, Norway
Registered: 2014-02-22
Posts: 268

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Welkin! Don't leave. I've only seen one of your robberies - the one with the vault penis. Your mind belongs in this game. Ask it! It'll say the same thing.


Current life: Unknown

Rotary toggle switches... Sooooo sexy.

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#17 2014-04-14 08:40:15

TheRealCheese
Member
Registered: 2014-01-25
Posts: 349

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

If multiple accounts had no financial interaction with eachother what so ever, I would not give a rats ass. It's the fact that you can generate income independent of other peoples houses or their visits to your house. This is a great example of "getting something faster" IS a detriment to the game and not as some people have claimed, not a particularly strong advantage.

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#18 2014-04-14 09:01:42

cullman
Member
Registered: 2014-03-21
Posts: 424

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

TheRealCheese wrote:

If multiple accounts had no financial interaction with eachother what so ever, I would not give a rats ass. It's the fact that you can generate income independent of other peoples houses or their visits to your house. This is a great example of "getting something faster" IS a detriment to the game and not as some people have claimed, not a particularly strong advantage.

I'm not sure what you are saying, but I think being able to generate $20-$30k of free cash a night with a single alt is a problem, and not just "getting something faster".

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#19 2014-04-14 09:06:02

TheRealCheese
Member
Registered: 2014-01-25
Posts: 349

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

My point exactly, cullman, the "we're not getting anything you can't get on a solo account we're just getting it faster" has been one of the argument points of the pro-multiaccount crowd.

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#20 2014-04-14 09:13:55

cullman
Member
Registered: 2014-03-21
Posts: 424

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

TheRealCheese wrote:

My point exactly, cullman, the "we're not getting anything you can't get on a solo account we're just getting it faster" has been one of the argument points of the pro-multiaccount crowd.

Ah ok, you think these arguments would be done and over now that Jason has publicly stated he is anti-dual accounts.

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#21 2014-04-14 09:26:51

tigey101
Member
Registered: 2014-04-07
Posts: 19

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

I don't like multi accounts but except it as part of the game now. I look at it like it's the mafia and has "businesses" that supply it with money for protection. I agree with Welkin in that there should be a way to trace the money.

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#22 2014-04-14 09:36:17

cullman
Member
Registered: 2014-03-21
Posts: 424

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

tigey101 wrote:

I don't like multi accounts but except it as part of the game now. I look at it like it's the mafia and has "businesses" that supply it with money for protection. I agree with Welkin in that there should be a way to trace the money.

I proposed this very thing last week, and was going to start a new server on this premise but did not get enough interest.

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#23 2014-04-14 09:59:55

Blip
Member
Registered: 2013-05-07
Posts: 505

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Welkin wrote:

Then I had a time where my house was locked out by Alec Sean Farley who in combination with JGA did this strange tag-team lock. During this time every click of 'return to house' that got denied refreshed the list that I had filtered to his account. I watched his money go from 2k, to 12k, to 60k, to 30k (I assume he grabbed items from his stock? Maybe had an account rob him back to take half?) in the span of literally minutes. I could do nothing, luckily this guy was not able to break too much of the surface, but then I realized the scope of the money he could pull in.

He basically was un-killable, only thing I could target was JGA which he had no investment in. He was only a front to attack me and take any heat he could get. ASF and his 30k that wasn't used to attack me dissipated. This annoys me so much, after two days of being stalked by this guy I gave up. It's not like my value was even that high, I was mid on the top 8 list. Not sure what he was doing but I'll be damned if it didn't ruin my fun. Being attacked by people you can defend from and attack back, that would be ok. Being targeted by someone you do not know, who can siphon his resources seemingly at a whim, who sends an alt to lock me out of my house while he sets up another account, that is not ok.

So I guess I was Farley, and I'm assuming that you're Mr. Black, as he was my final target late yesterday. Here's my part of the story.

After I suicided to put Kane's paintings back to auction, I was left with lots of chills on most stepping stone houses, so my chain robbing possibilities were limited. I managed to get one account up to a good chunk of cash, and ended up using the other as a bare minimum scout. I robbed somebody (don't remember who) and used my winnings to take down Case. The only other top house that I didn't have chills on was Black, and only with my wealthy account: Farley. Thus, I did a bunch of scouting of Black's place with Farley, then eventually began a larger robbery that nearly got the cops coming. As I was rushing to try and finish, after running out of drugged meat and being chased by a dog, I ran into a wall-dog in front of me. I had no option other than to die.

As for my rapid cash rise, that wasn't from any alt abuse, it was from successful robberies. And when my money dropped, it wasn't because I was transferring cash - it was because I had grabbed a bunch of tools for a robbery.  During the chain the took down Case, I only used my other account once, and as a suicide scout for the second house in the chain. I also was clearly not conspiring with eppfel, mostly because I robbed him for $100k.

Frankly, I don't see the problem here. Welkin was targeted by two different people, neither of us working together. It just so happened that two wealthy people targeted him at once! If anything, this shows the problem with this forum: two separate players get branded as cheaters for playing the game regularly. I was just chain robbing, and people assume that I was getting rich off bounty transfers, and that I was conspiring with JGA! Not a single person, other than eppfel who knew better, realized that. And nobody seems to be reading the truth here: AMWhy, cullman, TheRealCheese, and others are still claiming that what happened was due to alts.


Current life: Not dead, but I have no clue who I am
The Life and Times of Christopher Alvin Harris
Record: 149 Paintings!

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#24 2014-04-14 10:22:54

StefanLindskog
Member
From: Oslo, Norway
Registered: 2014-02-22
Posts: 268

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

TheRealCheese only said: "getting something faster" IS a detriment to the game. I can't see any situation where having multiple accounts is not.


Current life: Unknown

Rotary toggle switches... Sooooo sexy.

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#25 2014-04-14 10:29:55

MMaster
Member
Registered: 2014-02-12
Posts: 325

Re: I quit as well & 'Multiple Accounts At Their Most Malicious'

Bottom line alts and people that use them ruin this game.

And people that own guns are killers.

tigey101 wrote:

I don't like multi accounts but except it as part of the game now. I look at it like it's the mafia and has "businesses" that supply it with money for protection. I agree with Welkin in that there should be a way to trace the money.

Yeah! Finally someone who understands and makes it part of his game instead of bitching about it in every other post on the forums. Congratulations for making your game much more entertaining for you.


I'm not going to argue about the multi-account stuff anymore as people apparently don't get it. If you feel it is worth your time then try to stop the multiple account users. I know it is not possible so I will rather play the game.

The only thing we can do is to say: "eppfel it was really not nice of you to abuse your accounts this way. Please don't do it anymore." ... and eppfel won't give a shit as well as other people from this forum or outside of this forum abusing their multiple accounts.

You can try and report him to Jason, but I seriously doubt he will be banned even though Jason is "anti-dual accounts".


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