Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

crazyace · 2014-04-24 20:24:37

Jason bro - you said you are too busy on your next project - run a sale, this game $5 (common 12.) - go against your own grain - blame me. 'Those who' make thousands a day on things that don't even matter. People care about you. Help. I try - they attack me.

Sale, like every product right now, can save you invisible '$1000s' . Jason save them $5. Not all millionaires care about grammar but we all deeply enthuse.

Lord0fHam · 2014-04-24 21:25:00

what are you talking about?

crazyace · 2014-04-24 21:29:01

No one will feel disrespected by a discount. He made it public it wont happen. Sometimes go against your own grain. People sell $0 for 10$ because of 'sales'

Last edited by crazyace (2014-04-24 21:30:21)

TheRealCheese · 2014-04-24 21:29:03

He's trying to persuade Jason to put the game on sale despite having publically said, before release, that he would never. I'm not against a sale, but it will not happen.
He goes on to remark that he makes a lot of money himself and his wife buys lots of things on sale.

crazyace · 2014-04-24 21:30:47

Life is a sale. Sales clown all.

Last edited by crazyace (2014-04-24 21:31:13)

StefanLindskog · 2014-04-24 23:54:57

Even though Crazyace isn't very eloquent about the subject, he has a very valid point. If we all take the poll supplied by Lord0fHam here: http://strawpoll.me/1571641 - maybe we can change Jasons mind.

Last edited by StefanLindskog (2014-04-24 23:55:37)

Pohaku · 2014-04-25 00:04:08

1) If I go and take a load of drugs and then come back here, will this thread make more sense?!

2) On a serious note: Jason's a smart guy (I expect). He must know that the two options are (a) change his mind and go against what he said publicly, or (b) let this game die. I personally hope he changes his mind. A lot of people perceive going back on themselves to be a weakness, and refuse to admit that they could have been wrong, sticking to their principles at all costs.

Accepting that things have turned out differently than planned, and changing your mind on something, is not a weakness, it is strength. Perhaps Jason doesn't see this.

Or perhaps he is happy to see TCD die, having run its natural course as a bit of an experiment. That would be a real shame, but it's his perogative.

One thing I do think is that if he is going to let the game die, he should make this clear on the sales page. It is £12.99 on Steam, advertised as a 'massively-multiplayer' game. That is becoming a lie, and people might hear of it, come and buy it, only to find that it is virtually unplayable now - letting them pay £12.99 for that is wrong.

StefanLindskog · 2014-04-25 00:11:24

Pohaku wrote:

One thing I do think is that if he is going to let the game die, he should make this clear on the sales page. It is £12.99 on Steam, advertised as a 'massively-multiplayer' game. That is becoming a lie, and people might hear of it, come and buy it, only to find that it is virtually unplayable now - letting them pay £12.99 for that is wrong.

That's a very valid point. Do the poll everyone. Let's show Jason we love this game too much for him to not change his mind about the sales thing.

Cylence · 2014-04-25 00:33:50

Unfortunately, I can't participate in the poll. I purchased before it became full price.

MMaster · 2014-04-25 01:53:30

This has been discussed several times. It's not gonna happen. Jason was very clear about it. The main reason you see big decline in players between February and March is because people bought it and didn't like it. That's what steam is about - people just buy stuff they don't like because it's on front page in sale for only few bucks - they try it and then never play it again.

Pohaku · 2014-04-25 02:28:47

MMaster wrote:

This has been discussed several times. It's not gonna happen. Jason was very clear about it. The main reason you see big decline in players between February and March is because people bought it and didn't like it. That's what steam is about - people just buy stuff they don't like because it's on front page in sale for only few bucks - they try it and then never play it again.

1) Jason was very clear about it. That doesn't mean he can't change his mind. If he still thinks that never putting on sale is the right thing to do, despite it being clear that this stance will kill the game off, then fine - I would not argue with him. He has that view, and only he has any say in the pricing of the game. If, however, he has changed his view and thinks that the right thing to do is to put it on sale to save/grow the player base (and therefore the game itself) then it would be very weak of him to refuse to do so simply because he was so firm about it back then. Just because you have a very firm view about something doesn't mean you can't change your mind.

2) I thought that the primary driver behind him sticking the price point firmly where it is, is to stop people who didn't really want to stick at the game from buying it in the first place, like so many do with the £2-3 games. If your third sentence is true, then it would seem that the fixed price point has not achieved this aim anyway.

3) If Jason is sticking to his guns on this, then something needs to be done about the description of the game that is advertised. I happened across a review of TCD about a month ago, and bought it on the back of that review. I've had a month or so of play out of it, and I do continue to play but it's almost dormant now. Had I happened across that review yesterday, I would still have bought the game - and would now be feeling that I had been ripped off, and would be asking for a refund. Not because the game is any different, but because TCD *IS* the playerbase. No players = no game.

Because it is 'capable of supporting large numbers of players' it is still, by definition, a MMOG. However, I think that potential new customers should be made aware of how few people there are playing it, and how this will detract from their experience. Imagine a huge paintballing park charging full price entry, on the strength that you could be taking part in epic paintball battles in a huge arena, only for you to get in there and find the place almost deserted with nobody to shoot at. It wouldn't be fair.

I have replied with bullet-points because it's how I organise my thoughts, by the way - I know it can seem arsey, but that's not how I mean it to read. :-)

MMaster · 2014-04-25 02:51:16

Pohaku wrote:

MMaster wrote:
This has been discussed several times. It's not gonna happen. Jason was very clear about it. The main reason you see big decline in players between February and March is because people bought it and didn't like it. That's what steam is about - people just buy stuff they don't like because it's on front page in sale for only few bucks - they try it and then never play it again.
1) Jason was very clear about it. That doesn't mean he can't change his mind. If he still thinks that never putting on sale is the right thing to do, despite it being clear that this stance will kill the game off, then fine - I would not argue with him. He has that view, and only he has any say in the pricing of the game. If, however, he has changed his view and thinks that the right thing to do is to put it on sale to save/grow the player base (and therefore the game itself) then it would be very weak of him to refuse to do so simply because he was so firm about it back then. Just because you have a very firm view about something doesn't mean you can't change your mind.

I agree. Still .. I would be really surprised if he changes his mind on this one.

Pohaku wrote:

2) I thought that the primary driver behind him sticking the price point firmly where it is, is to stop people who didn't really want to stick at the game from buying it in the first place, like so many do with the £2-3 games. If your third sentence is true, then it would seem that the fixed price point has not achieved this aim anyway.

The game was on sale on steam when it was released.

Pohaku wrote:

3) If Jason is sticking to his guns on this, then something needs to be done about the description of the game that is advertised. I happened across a review of TCD about a month ago, and bought it on the back of that review. I've had a month or so of play out of it, and I do continue to play but it's almost dormant now. Had I happened across that review yesterday, I would still have bought the game - and would now be feeling that I had been ripped off, and would be asking for a refund. Not because the game is any different, but because TCD *IS* the playerbase. No players = no game.

Steam people don't read descriptions, they buy cheap games in sales. I agree on player base. The question is if you put the game on sale how many real castle doctrine players will you get and how many people will just buy it and never play it (or play it once).

Pohaku wrote:

Because it is 'capable of supporting large numbers of players' it is still, by definition, a MMOG. However, I think that potential new customers should be made aware of how few people there are playing it, and how this will detract from their experience. Imagine a huge paintballing park charging full price entry, on the strength that you could be taking part in epic paintball battles in a huge arena, only for you to get in there and find the place almost deserted with nobody to shoot at. It wouldn't be fair.
I have replied with bullet-points because it's how I organise my thoughts, by the way - I know it can seem arsey, but that's not how I mean it to read. :-)

I think there is still enough people playing it for you to have great experience even now. But I agree that this game would not be playable without people and so it will eventually die (it's inevitable as it is not being developed anymore). That's why we try to attract more people to play it. I understand why you want sale and I don't want to speak for Jason in any way. I just knew his stance on this from his previous statements.

mala · 2014-04-25 08:30:02

If Jason wants to stick with his decision about sales, there's nothing we can do about it.

Still a product does not grow on sales and/or promotions. A product grows by advertising.
During the Steam sale, peoples were able to KNOW that such game existed (as happened to me), because it was on front page.

We all know the game is great, all it lacks is proper advertising.

Just let peoples discover the game and there will be plenty of newcomers.
(thrilled newcomers, not "ok it's 3$ let's buy it" newcomers).

That's what i'd like to address to Jason:
Jason, you've made an amazing work, just spam your product name everywhere you can (it may sounds bad, but that's what advertising is all about), we as a community will try to give the game as much visibility as we can, but we do need your support.

My 2c

Last edited by mala (2014-04-25 08:40:32)

StefanLindskog · 2014-04-25 08:36:01

I still believe in a targeted Facebook ad campaign. You could, for instance, target people who like FTL -and only pay to expose them to the ads. The ads have to be to the point and lead somewhere with valid information about the game and links to videos, the forum and other relevant stuff. I guess this post really belongs elsewhere.

gyuri · 2014-04-25 14:01:20

Well, with all the money cullman payed for revenge and stuff, we could buy a dozen new accounts or support new players with half the price, so that would be some kind of community powered sale.

Another idea: what if everyone with two or more accounts sells one of them for $8 or something?

cullman · 2014-04-25 21:14:52

gyuri wrote:

Well, with all the money cullman payed for revenge and stuff, we could buy a dozen new accounts or support new players with half the price, so that would be some kind of community powered sale.
Another idea: what if everyone with two or more accounts sells one of them for $8 or something?

Just stopping by, I offered money for revenge. Never paid for revenge. I used that as a mechanism to figure out how people cheat. It worked. I believe the game is improved for it. I think there is a way to save this game. Offer more clients (iOS, Android), fix the map cheat, fix the DC scout cheat, make it easier for beginners with 2k house saving, smooth out learning curve, improve dual account cheating (I think I would make people have one name - a major departure from Jason's brilliant vision, and does ruin a bit of the game, but stops the dual account conspiracy problems real and imagined), start a new contest with $25k in prizes. Readvertise. This was roughly my game plan, but I didn't have as much support from the community as I'd have liked. My thought, wait for the game to die more, see if people start to see things my way enough to get a ground swell of support to make this project worth the time and money.

Last edited by cullman (2014-04-25 21:18:22)

iceman · 2014-04-25 21:47:36

Cullman, I don't think waiting is going to produce more people to try your idea; just the opposite, in fact. I don't think there's going to be a very big increase in forum visiters. I think that almost everybody who visits the forum said they'd support your idea (I'm actually a bit surprised you got 17 people, actually). Almost everybody who plays the game but doesn't check the forums isn't going to come here when they get desperate. They're just going to stop playing. Like you said, 17 people might not make it worth going through with your plan... but I don't think you're going to get any more by waiting.

cullman · 2014-04-26 11:09:12

iceman wrote:

Cullman, I don't think waiting is going to produce more people to try your idea; just the opposite, in fact. I don't think there's going to be a very big increase in forum visiters. I think that almost everybody who visits the forum said they'd support your idea (I'm actually a bit surprised you got 17 people, actually). Almost everybody who plays the game but doesn't check the forums isn't going to come here when they get desperate. They're just going to stop playing. Like you said, 17 people might not make it worth going through with your plan... but I don't think you're going to get any more by waiting.

You are probably right...What's the attendance like on the free server right now?

iceman · 2014-04-26 12:13:18

cullman wrote:

You are probably right...What's the attendance like on the free server right now?

Well, on Fortress Theory, the max I ever got in 1 day was 17 unique players. It looks like there might be 6 "regulars", and since I released the update there's been about 10 on average. As for MMaster's server... I'm not sure, but when I logged in a few days ago the houses looked like they hadn't been touched in a long time.

The Castle Doctrine Forums

#1 2014-04-24 20:24:37

Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#2 2014-04-24 21:25:00

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#3 2014-04-24 21:29:01

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#4 2014-04-24 21:29:03

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#5 2014-04-24 21:30:47

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#6 2014-04-24 23:54:57

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#7 2014-04-25 00:04:08

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#8 2014-04-25 00:11:24

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#9 2014-04-25 00:33:50

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#10 2014-04-25 01:53:30

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#11 2014-04-25 02:28:47

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#12 2014-04-25 02:51:16

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#13 2014-04-25 08:30:02

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#14 2014-04-25 08:36:01

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#15 2014-04-25 14:01:20

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#16 2014-04-25 21:14:52

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#17 2014-04-25 21:47:36

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#18 2014-04-26 11:09:12

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

#19 2014-04-26 12:13:18

Re: Jason - 'Sale' is a sillly word, make thousands daily based on 'sale'

Board footer